TCP port 3505 is popular for a card reader - Any other programs using it?

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TCP port 3505 is popular for a card reader - Any other programs using it?

Hercules390 - General mailing list
I have a customer who for weeks has enjoyed the myDOSVS gui I sent him. Then a couple of days ago I get an email that the startup procedure has failed because something has connected to the card reader port 3505 and won't let go.  It's not my program doing this and I have not googled anything that panned out to an obvious answer to the problem.  Is anyone aware of other windows programs that might be out there grabbing port 3505?  I see in the list of TCP ports that there is something called ccmcomm but google as I have I can't find out what it is or does.  Thanks in advance for any hints.

Regards

Buddy Bell
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Re: TCP port 3505 is popular for a card reader - Any other programs using it?

Hercules390 - General mailing list
 > I have a customer who for weeks has enjoyed the myDOSVS gui I sent
 > him. Then a couple of days ago I get an email that the startup
 > procedure has failed because something has connected to the card
 > reader port 3505 and won't let go.  It's not my program doing this
 > and I have not googled anything that panned out to an obvious answer
 > to the problem.  Is anyone aware of other windows programs that might
 > be out there grabbing port 3505?  I see in the list of TCP ports that
 > there is something called ccmcomm but google as I have I can't find
 > out what it is or does.  Thanks in advance for any hints.

The IANA listing for that port includes an email address in a domain
that has no servers.  That's probably an old commercial software package
that doesn't exist any more.

The internet also mentions a trojan using that port.

But the real cause is probably either a leftover hercules listener, or a
port scan from the internet.

De
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RE: TCP port 3505 is popular for a card reader - Any other programs using it?

Hercules390 - General mailing list
In reply to this post by Hercules390 - General mailing list
Buddy,

You might to get him to pop and elevated command prompt and run :-

 

netstat -b -a

 

which should show which executable has the port.  (He may need to pip into more)

I see from :-

 

http://www.adminsub.net/tcp-udp-port-finder/3505

 

it can be used by Trojansā€¦

 

Dave Wade

G4UGM

 

From: [hidden email] [mailto:[hidden email]]
Sent: 03 April 2017 20:37
To: [hidden email]
Subject: [hercules-390] TCP port 3505 is popular for a card reader - Any other programs using it?

 



I have a customer who for weeks has enjoyed the myDOSVS gui I sent him. Then a couple of days ago I get an email that the startup procedure has failed because something has connected to the card reader port 3505 and won't let go.  It's not my program doing this and I have not googled anything that panned out to an obvious answer to the problem.  Is anyone aware of other windows programs that might be out there grabbing port 3505?  I see in the list of TCP ports that there is something called ccmcomm but google as I have I can't find out what it is or does.  Thanks in advance for any hints.

Regards

Buddy Bell






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Re: TCP port 3505 is popular for a card reader - Any other programs using it?

Hercules390 - General mailing list
In reply to this post by Hercules390 - General mailing list


On 4/3/2017 10:14 PM, Dennis Boone [hidden email] [hercules-390] wrote:

>   > I have a customer who for weeks has enjoyed the myDOSVS gui I sent
>   > him. Then a couple of days ago I get an email that the startup
>   > procedure has failed because something has connected to the card
>   > reader port 3505 and won't let go.  It's not my program doing this
>   > and I have not googled anything that panned out to an obvious answer
>   > to the problem.  Is anyone aware of other windows programs that might
>   > be out there grabbing port 3505?  I see in the list of TCP ports that
>   > there is something called ccmcomm but google as I have I can't find
>   > out what it is or does.  Thanks in advance for any hints.
>
> The IANA listing for that port includes an email address in a domain
> that has no servers.  That's probably an old commercial software package
> that doesn't exist any more.
>
> The internet also mentions a trojan using that port.
>
> But the real cause is probably either a leftover hercules listener, or a
> port scan from the internet.
>
>
I'm assuming this is under windows.

What does netstat -anb (as an admin) say ?

Be aware that any port above 1024 is never guaranteed to be free. It
could be grabbed by an outbound TCP socket by automatic binding for example.

--Ivan



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

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Re: TCP port 3505 is popular for a card reader - Any other programs using it?

Hercules390 - General mailing list
Ivan, on most UNIXen one can specify min and max for ephemeral ports to
ensure that most of the well-known ports are not being used for outgoing
connexions.  Hasn't Windows something similar?

On 04/03/2017 10:30 PM, Ivan Warren [hidden email] [hercules-390] wrote:

>
>
>
>
> On 4/3/2017 10:14 PM, Dennis Boone [hidden email] [hercules-390] wrote:
>> > I have a customer who for weeks has enjoyed the myDOSVS gui I sent
>> > him. Then a couple of days ago I get an email that the startup
>> > procedure has failed because something has connected to the card
>> > reader port 3505 and won't let go. It's not my program doing this
>> > and I have not googled anything that panned out to an obvious answer
>> > to the problem. Is anyone aware of other windows programs that might
>> > be out there grabbing port 3505? I see in the list of TCP ports that
>> > there is something called ccmcomm but google as I have I can't find
>> > out what it is or does. Thanks in advance for any hints.
>>
>> The IANA listing for that port includes an email address in a domain
>> that has no servers. That's probably an old commercial software package
>> that doesn't exist any more.
>>
>> The internet also mentions a trojan using that port.
>>
>> But the real cause is probably either a leftover hercules listener, or a
>> port scan from the internet.
>>
>>
> I'm assuming this is under windows.
>
> What does netstat -anb (as an admin) say ?
>
> Be aware that any port above 1024 is never guaranteed to be free. It
> could be grabbed by an outbound TCP socket by automatic binding for example.
>
> --Ivan
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>


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Re: TCP port 3505 is popular for a card reader - Any other programs using it?

Hercules390 - General mailing list


On 4/3/2017 10:47 PM, 'John P. Hartmann' [hidden email]
[hercules-390] wrote:
> Ivan, on most UNIXen one can specify min and max for ephemeral ports to
> ensure that most of the well-known ports are not being used for outgoing
> connexions.  Hasn't Windows something similar?
>
Good point John !

I hadn't thought of that. But there probably is... somewhere... deep in
the registry (or via netsh ?).

--Ivan



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

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RE: TCP port 3505 is popular for a card reader - Any other programs using it?

Hercules390 - General mailing list


> -----Original Message-----
> From: [hidden email] [mailto:hercules-
> [hidden email]]
> Sent: 03 April 2017 22:14
> To: [hidden email]
> Subject: Re: [hercules-390] TCP port 3505 is popular for a card reader -
Any

> other programs using it?
>
>
>
> On 4/3/2017 10:47 PM, 'John P. Hartmann' [hidden email] [hercules-
> 390] wrote:
> > Ivan, on most UNIXen one can specify min and max for ephemeral ports
> > to ensure that most of the well-known ports are not being used for
> > outgoing connexions.  Hasn't Windows something similar?
> >
> Good point John !
>
> I hadn't thought of that. But there probably is... somewhere... deep in
the
> registry (or via netsh ?).
>
> --Ivan
>

Try this article:-

https://support.microsoft.com/en-gb/help/929851/the-default-dynamic-port-ran
ge-for-tcp-ip-has-changed-in-windows-vista-and-in-windows-server-2008

Dave


>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
>
> ------------------------------------
> Posted by: Ivan Warren <[hidden email]>
> ------------------------------------
>
> Community email addresses:
>   Post message: [hidden email]
>   Subscribe:    [hidden email]
>   Unsubscribe:  [hidden email]
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>
> Get the latest version of Hercules from:
>   http://www.hercules-390.org
>
>
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> Yahoo Groups Links
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Re: TCP port 3505 is popular for a card reader - Any other programs using it?

Hercules390 - General mailing list
Hi,


Well maybe I'm wildly mistaken here (and please ignore the message if so), but from reading these past responses it appears to me that some of the respondents have things slightly mixed up, and are confusing one thing with the other :


1.)
The OP was referencing the fixed listen ports that programs/daemons/services on the 'server' side listen on for incoming connections. If you want a program to listen on a specific port for incoming connections, it needs to be free and available and not in use for listening by another program already.

2.)
Some of the responders are talking about the random/dynamic/ephemeral ports that are created on the 'client' side for outgoing connections. These get assigned randomly as needed from the entire available port range, so if port 3505 is already in use for outgoing connections then another free port from the entire range gets selected.


While these are connected, they are not the same : If I understand things correctly one can have both a program/daemon/service like Hercules listening on port 3505 for incoming connections, and have still use port 3505 for outgoing connections. They are two different pools.

The original problem to me seems to be that another program is already listening on fixed port 3505 for incoming connections, so that Hercules (card reader) cannot use it anymore, and not that the OP has run out of the entire free range of ports for outgoing client connections. A quick Google on 'program port 3505' gets some hits for 'trojans/malware' that by default listen on this socket. If this is indeed the case, the solution would be to use an anti-virus program to remove the trojan that is keeping the socket in use, which would once more free it up for use by Hercules.


- Maarten
 


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Re: TCP port 3505 is popular for a card reader - Any other programs using it?

Hercules390 - General mailing list
Maarten,

bind() fails with EADDRINUSE, long before listen() is set up for the
port.

Perhaps you got confused by the quintuple that defines a TCP session.

On 04/13/2017 12:24 PM, [hidden email] [hercules-390] wrote:

>
>
> Hi,
>
>
> Well maybe I'm wildly mistaken here (and please ignore the message if
> so), but from reading these past responses it appears to me that some of
> the respondents have things slightly mixed up, and are confusing one
> thing with the other :
>
>
> 1.)
> The OP was referencing the fixed listen ports that
> programs/daemons/services on the 'server' side listen on for incoming
> connections. If you want a program to listen on a specific port for
> incoming connections, it needs to be free and available and not in use
> for listening by another program already.
>
> 2.)
> Some of the responders are talking about the random/dynamic/ephemeral
> ports that are created on the 'client' side for outgoing connections.
> These get assigned randomly as needed from the entire available port
> range, so if port 3505 is already in use for outgoing connections then
> another free port from the entire range gets selected.
>
>
> While these are connected, they are not the same : If I understand
> things correctly one can have both a program/daemon/service like
> Hercules listening on port 3505 for incoming connections, and have still
> use port 3505 for outgoing connections. They are two different pools.
>
> The original problem to me seems to be that another program is already
> listening on fixed port 3505 for incoming connections, so that Hercules
> (card reader) cannot use it anymore, and not that the OP has run out of
> the entire free range of ports for outgoing client connections. A quick
> Google on 'program port 3505' gets some hits for 'trojans/malware' that
> by default listen on this socket. If this is indeed the case, the
> solution would be to use an anti-virus program to remove the trojan that
> is keeping the socket in use, which would once more free it up for use
> by Hercules.
>
>
> - Maarten
>
>
>
>
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Re: TCP port 3505 is popular for a card reader - Any other programs using it?

Hercules390 - General mailing list
Hi,

On Thu, Apr 13, 2017 at 12:58 PM, 'John P. Hartmann' [hidden email]
[hercules-390] <[hidden email]> wrote:

>
>
> Maarten,
>
> bind() fails with EADDRINUSE, long before listen() is set up for the
> port.
>
> Perhaps you got confused by the quintuple that defines a TCP session.
>
> Perhaps I have gotten confused. It's been a while since I last took a real
look at the workings of TCP.
;)

I have to agree with you that (even though I'm not a developer) when the
TCP port is already in use, that (most likely, again, I'm no dev) it's
'bind()' that fails with 'EADDRINUSE'. I guess the point I was trying to
make was that the most likely cause for the port being in use, is that
'malware/trojan/virus' is listening on that port preventing it's use by
Hercules, and not that the OP has run out of dynamic/ephemeral ports to
assign.


I'll crawl back under my rock now.


- Maarten
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Re: TCP port 3505 is popular for a card reader - Any other programs using it?

Hercules390 - General mailing list
In reply to this post by Hercules390 - General mailing list


On 4/13/2017 12:58 PM, 'John P. Hartmann' [hidden email]
[hercules-390] wrote:

> Maarten,
>
> bind() fails with EADDRINUSE, long before listen() is set up for the
> port.
>
> Perhaps you got confused by the quintuple that defines a TCP session.
>
> On 04/13/2017 12:24 PM, [hidden email] [hercules-390] wrote:
>>
>> Hi,
>>
>>
>> Well maybe I'm wildly mistaken here (and please ignore the message if
>> so), but from reading these past responses it appears to me that some of
>> the respondents have things slightly mixed up, and are confusing one
>> thing with the other :
>>
>>
>> 1.)
>> The OP was referencing the fixed listen ports that
>> programs/daemons/services on the 'server' side listen on for incoming
>> connections. If you want a program to listen on a specific port for
>> incoming connections, it needs to be free and available and not in use
>> for listening by another program already.
>>
>> 2.)
>> Some of the responders are talking about the random/dynamic/ephemeral
>> ports that are created on the 'client' side for outgoing connections.
>> These get assigned randomly as needed from the entire available port
>> range, so if port 3505 is already in use for outgoing connections then
>> another free port from the entire range gets selected.
>>
Marteen,

If a local port has been automatically selected for an outgoing TCP
connection (to identify the local side) and you try to bind() WITH
IN_ADDRANY or the same address used for the already established outgoing
connection using that same, the bind() call will return -1 with errno
set to EADDRINUSE. the SOCKREUSEADDR socket option only allows
overriding ports bound to sockets in the transient TIME_WAIT[1] state.

--Ivan

[1] The TIME_WAIT state is a transient state that lasts usually around
30 seconds (but it's usually configurable). The purpose of the TIME_WAIT
state is to prevent the TCP stack from responding to old packets
arriving late after the session has been closed.



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

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Re: TCP port 3505 is popular for a card reader - Any other programs using it?

Hercules390 - General mailing list
In reply to this post by Hercules390 - General mailing list
Maarten,

If your system is a Windows system, I should tend to agree with you that
it is likely full of vira and trojans.

Mine isn't (any of above) and the only reason a port would be randomly
in use would be its assignment to an epehemeral connexion.

On 04/13/2017 01:10 PM, Maarten Hoes [hidden email]
[hercules-390] wrote:

>
>
> Hi,
>
> On Thu, Apr 13, 2017 at 12:58 PM, 'John P. Hartmann'
> [hidden email] <mailto:[hidden email]> [hercules-390]
> <[hidden email] <mailto:[hidden email]>> wrote:
>
>     __
>
>
>     Maarten,
>
>     bind() fails with EADDRINUSE, long before listen() is set up for the
>     port.
>
>     Perhaps you got confused by the quintuple that defines a TCP session.
>
>
> Perhaps I have gotten confused. It's been a while since I last took a
> real look at the workings of TCP.
> ;)
>
> I have to agree with you that (even though I'm not a developer) when the
> TCP port is already in use, that (most likely, again, I'm no dev) it's
> 'bind()' that fails with 'EADDRINUSE'. I guess the point I was trying to
> make was that the most likely cause for the port being in use, is that
> 'malware/trojan/virus' is listening on that port preventing it's use by
> Hercules, and not that the OP has run out of dynamic/ephemeral ports to
> assign.
>
>
> I'll crawl back under my rock now.
>
>
> - Maarten
>
>
>
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Re: TCP port 3505 is popular for a card reader - Any other programs using it?

Hercules390 - General mailing list
In reply to this post by Hercules390 - General mailing list


On 4/13/2017 12:58 PM, 'John P. Hartmann' [hidden email]
[hercules-390] wrote:
> Maarten,
>
> bind() fails with EADDRINUSE, long before listen() is set up for the
> port.
>
> Perhaps you got confused by the quintuple that defines a TCP session.
>
John,

Curious.. I always thought a socket was defined by a "quadruple" (local
address, local port, remote address, remote port).. What is the 5th guy ?

Thanks,

--Ivan



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

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Re: TCP port 3505 is popular for a card reader - Any other programs using it?

Hercules390 - General mailing list
TCP vs UDP.

On 04/13/2017 01:18 PM, Ivan Warren [hidden email] [hercules-390] wrote:
> John,
>
> Curious.. I always thought a socket was defined by a "quadruple" (local
> address, local port, remote address, remote port).. What is the 5th guy ?


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Re: TCP port 3505 is popular for a card reader - Any other programs using it?

Hercules390 - General mailing list
In reply to this post by Hercules390 - General mailing list
Hi,

On Thu, Apr 13, 2017 at 1:14 PM, Ivan Warren [hidden email]
[hercules-390] <[hidden email]> wrote:

>
>
>
>
> On 4/13/2017 12:58 PM, 'John P. Hartmann' [hidden email]
> [hercules-390] wrote:
> > Maarten,
> >
> > bind() fails with EADDRINUSE, long before listen() is set up for the
> > port.
> >
> > Perhaps you got confused by the quintuple that defines a TCP session.
> >
> > On 04/13/2017 12:24 PM, [hidden email] [hercules-390] wrote:
> >>
> >> Hi,
> >>
> >>
> >> Well maybe I'm wildly mistaken here (and please ignore the message if
> >> so), but from reading these past responses it appears to me that some of
> >> the respondents have things slightly mixed up, and are confusing one
> >> thing with the other :
> >>
> >>
> >> 1.)
> >> The OP was referencing the fixed listen ports that
> >> programs/daemons/services on the 'server' side listen on for incoming
> >> connections. If you want a program to listen on a specific port for
> >> incoming connections, it needs to be free and available and not in use
> >> for listening by another program already.
> >>
> >> 2.)
> >> Some of the responders are talking about the random/dynamic/ephemeral
> >> ports that are created on the 'client' side for outgoing connections.
> >> These get assigned randomly as needed from the entire available port
> >> range, so if port 3505 is already in use for outgoing connections then
> >> another free port from the entire range gets selected.
> >>
> Marteen,
>
> If a local port has been automatically selected for an outgoing TCP
> connection (to identify the local side) and you try to bind() WITH
> IN_ADDRANY or the same address used for the already established outgoing
> connection using that same, the bind() call will return -1 with errno
> set to EADDRINUSE. the SOCKREUSEADDR socket option only allows
> overriding ports bound to sockets in the transient TIME_WAIT[1] state.
>
> --Ivan
>
> [1] The TIME_WAIT state is a transient state that lasts usually around
> 30 seconds (but it's usually configurable). The purpose of the TIME_WAIT
> state is to prevent the TCP stack from responding to old packets
> arriving late after the session has been closed.
>

Thanks for correcting me on that part. I guess it's been too long since I
took a good look at the workings of TCP. I still feel though (see previous
response) that it's more likely another program (malware/trojan/another
legitimate program/daemon/service) is listening on that port, than that the
port is in use for an outgoing connection.


- Maarten
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Re: TCP port 3505 is popular for a card reader - Any other programs using it?

Hercules390 - General mailing list
In reply to this post by Hercules390 - General mailing list


On 4/13/2017 1:18 PM, 'John P. Hartmann' [hidden email]
[hercules-390] wrote:
> TCP vs UDP.
>
> On 04/13/2017 01:18 PM, Ivan Warren [hidden email] [hercules-390] wrote:
>> John,
>>
>> Curious.. I always thought a socket was defined by a "quadruple" (local
>> address, local port, remote address, remote port).. What is the 5th guy ?
>
John,

Well... You did say "TCP" session, and there is no such thing as an UDP
session (UDP is a connection-less protocol) !

Never mind ;)

--Ivan



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

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Re: TCP port 3505 is popular for a card reader - Any other programs using it?

Hercules390 - General mailing list
In reply to this post by Hercules390 - General mailing list
Hi,


Well although the OP (who does indeed appears to be running Windows, as he
mentions "other windows programs") hasn't responded himself yet, what
triggered me in the original post was this :

" something has connected to the card reader port 3505 and won't let go "

Although the "won't let go" part was not elaborated upon, I feel free to
assume that the OP has tried things like a reboot, and immediately
afterwards tried to start Hercules, only to discover the port was (again)
in use. If this is a correct assumption (but we all know what happens when
we assume), that makes it likely that another program is listening on the
port (although of course not impossible that the same dynamic/ephemeral
port got selected again for an outgoing connection).

Anyway, it appears were not going to agree on the "what's more likely to
happen" part here, so perhaps we should just "agree to disagree".
;)


- Maarten



On Thu, Apr 13, 2017 at 1:17 PM, 'John P. Hartmann' [hidden email]
[hercules-390] <[hidden email]> wrote:

>
>
> Maarten,
>
> If your system is a Windows system, I should tend to agree with you that
> it is likely full of vira and trojans.
>
> Mine isn't (any of above) and the only reason a port would be randomly
> in use would be its assignment to an epehemeral connexion.
>
> On 04/13/2017 01:10 PM, Maarten Hoes [hidden email]
> [hercules-390] wrote:
> >
> >
> > Hi,
> >
> > On Thu, Apr 13, 2017 at 12:58 PM, 'John P. Hartmann'
> > [hidden email] <mailto:[hidden email]> [hercules-390]
> > <[hidden email] <mailto:[hidden email]>>
> wrote:
> >
> > __
> >
> >
> > Maarten,
> >
> > bind() fails with EADDRINUSE, long before listen() is set up for the
> > port.
> >
> > Perhaps you got confused by the quintuple that defines a TCP session.
> >
> >
> > Perhaps I have gotten confused. It's been a while since I last took a
> > real look at the workings of TCP.
> > ;)
> >
> > I have to agree with you that (even though I'm not a developer) when the
> > TCP port is already in use, that (most likely, again, I'm no dev) it's
> > 'bind()' that fails with 'EADDRINUSE'. I guess the point I was trying to
> > make was that the most likely cause for the port being in use, is that
> > 'malware/trojan/virus' is listening on that port preventing it's use by
> > Hercules, and not that the OP has run out of dynamic/ephemeral ports to
> > assign.
> >
> >
> > I'll crawl back under my rock now.
> >
> >
> > - Maarten
> >
> >
> >
>
>
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Re: TCP port 3505 is popular for a card reader - Any other programs using it?

Hercules390 - General mailing list
In reply to this post by Hercules390 - General mailing list
Not correct.  Ask any firewall that supports VPN.

On 04/13/2017 01:39 PM, Ivan Warren [hidden email] [hercules-390] wrote:
> John,
>
> Well... You did say "TCP" session, and there is no such thing as an UDP
> session (UDP is a connection-less protocol) !
>
> Never mind ;)


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Re: TCP port 3505 is popular for a card reader - Any other programs using it?

Hercules390 - General mailing list
Hrm.

Not sure about this one. Although I can fully understand that a firewall
would try to maintain some sort of internal 'state' in order to correctly
allow/block traffic (or applications having state/sessions at the
*application* level), I always thought that at the protocol level itself
UDP does not maintain a session ?


- Maarten



On Thu, Apr 13, 2017 at 2:06 PM, 'John P. Hartmann' [hidden email]
[hercules-390] <[hidden email]> wrote:

> Not correct.  Ask any firewall that supports VPN.
>
> On 04/13/2017 01:39 PM, Ivan Warren [hidden email] [hercules-390]
> wrote:
> > John,
> >
> > Well... You did say "TCP" session, and there is no such thing as an UDP
> > session (UDP is a connection-less protocol) !
> >
> > Never mind ;)
>
>
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> Community email addresses:
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>   Subscribe:    [hidden email]
>   Unsubscribe:  [hidden email]
>   List owner:   [hidden email]
>
> Files and archives at:
>   http://groups.yahoo.com/group/hercules-390
>
> Get the latest version of Hercules from:
>   http://www.hercules-390.org
>
>
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> Yahoo Groups Links
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Re: TCP port 3505 is popular for a card reader - Any other programs using it?

Hercules390 - General mailing list
You can use sendto() on a UDP soclket to send to anyone, or you can bind
the socket and use send().  In that sense, it is a session, though it is
maintained in userland.

A firewall recognizes the UDP packet that starts a request (for some
protocols) and allows a response to travel in for some fixed time.

On 04/13/2017 02:13 PM, Maarten Hoes [hidden email]
[hercules-390] wrote:

>
>
> Hrm.
>
> Not sure about this one. Although I can fully understand that a firewall
> would try to maintain some sort of internal 'state' in order to
> correctly allow/block traffic (or applications having state/sessions at
> the *application* level), I always thought that at the protocol level
> itself UDP does not maintain a session ?
>
>
> - Maarten
>
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